I am having problems in Alcoholics Anonymous because I am a deist. And advice?!


Question: I am having problems in Alcoholics Anonymous because I am a deist. And advice.?
Usually folks put themselves in a few categories when it comes to faith in God. Either they are believers, non-believers (possibly atheists under this category), or don't know and don't care (possibly agnostics may fit in this category). But in my case, I do believe that there is a God who created the universe BUT this God cannot and will not intervene in any manner in our daily affairs. Almost like a puppet master who pulls no strings. I still believe in praying to acknowledge that there is a God, but I don't expect or demand this God to do anything for me. I realize that extremely bad things can happen at any given time for no apparent reason (like having a plane crash into a building you work in and it gets so hot and smoky inside that your only alternative is to jump to your death because nobody, including God, can or will save you) and the same can go for good things (like falling in love with someone). In AA I see a lot of folks around me praying to a higher power and asking this God to take over their lives because they are powerless over alcohol and they need someone to take the wheel and drive. But I find this to be futile. Can you see how a deist would have a conflict here.? Because he doesn't fit in any of the neatly organized categories. Have you ever heard of this type of thing.?Health Question & Answer


Answers:
Yes. Leave AA.

I'm dead serious.

AA does not, and will not ever aknowledge "any god you like" - that is a line they throw to the sick and desperate to try and get them in the door. You cannot complete the steps without believeing in THEIR god, who is a weird invention of Calvinism. What would even be the point in praying to a god you don't believe in to take speak to you.?

AA was based on a group in the 1930's called the Moral Re-Armorment. This is well documented in the writings of the sainted Bill.... he and several other founders were members.. But they didn't think alcoholics would "want to get too good too soon" so they invented steps which involved praying and debasing yourself to the group until you fell in line. Funny side note, Bill was under the influence of the "belladona" cure for alcohol at the time.. he was drugged out of his mind when he "saw god." :p

Google AA + religion - heck one night I googled "anti-AA" and came up with numerous resources.

My conflict with religion, god and AA became so bad I started to break down, and finally consulted a minister. He flat out told me this is b/s and nonsense and to get out while I was still sane. So did a catholic preist. You are not alone in being concerned.

Asking God (no matter what god you believe in) to take over your life IS futile. Get up, get out there and do it yourself!! All the prayer in the world can't live your life for you! YOU ARE NOT POWERLESS!! Actually, you are the most powerful animal on the planet, and the only one with any sort of free will, or the capacity to control your own destiny.

You are not the first person to have issues. If you go to Yahoo Groups, there are several devoted to people trying to either fight AA's monopoly on the alcohol treatment industry, or people exposing the lies in the program. "Agent Orange" has a marvelous website with tons of research and alternatives to 12 stepping.

Check out "Rational Recovery" and other alternatives - I found cognative behavior therapy most effective (actually, studies have shown that it's definatly the best way to go - it has a much higher success rate than AA, but none of the recruiting).

Get yourself back in the driver's seat. YOU control your body and your drinking, not a god on a cloud. You don't need to keep praying for help you don't personally believe will ever come. Use the brains you were gifted with.

If you email me, I'd be happy to send more sources, or help you look for answers or even just talk more. I know how really, REALLY hard it is to question AA's dogma... like I said, I nearly broke do...you're not alone in your confusion. Health Question & Answer

I've never heard of it, but now i know where i fit, so thanks. I believe that there is a higher power (although some research has shown that human beings are pre-programmed to have this belief - a left over from when we were animals) but that it has no influence over the operations of the planet so to speak. it sounds like you would like to take some responsibility for your actions. maybe the rest of your group should as well.Health Question & Answer

i feel the same way.
i drink alot although i don't believe i'm an alcoholic, when people have suggestted for me to go to AA that is one of the reasons why i won't.

everyone is different, use that higher power time in your own positive way.

i find mediatation helpfulHealth Question & Answer

I didn't go to Alcoholics Anonymous because of the same reason... (the God thing) And I can't/won't put my trust in some thing that I don't truly believe in. But the good news is there is a group (can't remember name) online that only expects "you can control and help yourself" They do have online meetings and books to help you see where you need help and to Be A Strong Person and Be In Control of Yourself! I joined it and read everything I could get my hands on and did the workbook to better myself. And even did a few meetings! (but couldn't put up with babies crying about how weak and couldn't do it! crap) But I can tell you "If you truly put your mind to it, you can & will be sober" I have been clean & sober for over 3 yrs now. And I drank for many, many years. Good Luck! & Be Strong!Health Question & Answer

Yes, isn't it outrageous.?

Here's the thing. I'm a former alcoholic, as in I drank myself into a stupor every day for over 20 years, but I haven't had a drop in ten.

I tried AA for a while. I liked many of the people and the ability to talk to people who understood how really hellish it is to be addicted.

But the program itself is nothing short of insanity. It's really little more than faith healing, and works about as well (i.e. it doesn't work any better than quitting on your own.) The worst part is if you hang around long enough so that it does start to make sense...

Anyway, if you want a support group there are better options. Try Smart Recovery.Health Question & Answer

The important thing here is the acknowledgement of a Higher Power and that this Higher Power and you must work together in order to get and remain clean and sober. It's not that the Higher Power takes over and does it all for you. That approach will never work in ten gazillion years. It's an equal partnership. Some call this Higher Power God or Jesus or Buddha or grace or nothing. Names don't matter. This Higher Power is not something outside of people. It is the life force within you which prompts you and encourages you towards sobriety. It is every good thing about you. It is the very seat of love, compassion, and forgiveness. The experience is going to be different for each person living with alcoholism because each person's life experience and spiritual experience is utterly unique.

I wish you every good thing in your journey through this life. Health Question & Answer

It is up to each person to create their own belief system. If you don't believe it will help to call on God, then it just won't help you. The faith has to be there for it to work.

Your options would be perhaps harder than just praying to a God for help. You need to find something you want to work towards, something that gives you personal strength to make it through your addiction. Some people have God, perhaps...you want to make it through so you can, I don't know, fly an airplane someday, or any number of things.

The thing is...your motivation if you do this will be internal. Someone praying to God is focusing on something external. In reality, you stand a better chance relying on internal motivation (something you can control) than external motivations (something you cannot control). What happens when they failed at quitting drinking.? They might go blame God. You have the option of understanding why you lost your way and can internally plan to get back on the road to your goal.Health Question & Answer



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